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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 7:31 pm 
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c60rider wrote:
ultimobici wrote:
OK. So double checked the rims we have and they have the same sticker. Mavic confirm that this relates to the maximum pressure with tubeless, 6 bar. Tyres & tubes maximum is 7 bar.


I emailed Condor on these as I'm not allowed to PM but heard nothing back yet would like a pair of 32h rim brake if a pair can be put for me please :D


Logic would be that this is for the maximum tire width no? And that would be I line with some actual ratings on their rims no?


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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
Posted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 7:31 pm 


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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 8:53 pm 
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+1 without tyre width the info is pretty much useless.


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 Post subject: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:55 pm 
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Why? 6 bars is 6 bars. If you need more than that, then you go to the next size up and reduce pressure.

My HED Belgium Plus rims have a sticker that says max. 100 psi (or ~7 bars).

Also, Mavic recommend a min. 25mm tire for their "wide" rims, if I remember correctly.

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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 11:15 pm 
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fa63 wrote:
Why? 6 bars is 6 bars.

Of pressure - pressure being force per unit of surface area. Therefore, the same pressure in a larger tyre means a greater total force trying to pull the bead through the rim. Hence (as Matt noted earlier) the recommendation on the old rims was between 9.5 and 6.7 depending on tyre size.


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 Post subject: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:17 am 
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Mavic website has been updated. They don't specify the tire-pressure but the range of recommended tires... Up to 47mm. 6bars on a 47mm tire I can't imagine that a 25 would be less than 8...
Image

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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:21 am 
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That is maximum pressure. With the min. recommended 28 mm tire, 6 bars in a tubeless setup should be good for someone really heavy (like 120kg, at which point one would be above Mavic's weight limit). With a 47 mm tire, the pressures would be much lower.

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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:32 am 
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I find it amusing that, with all we know about pressures & tyre width, people still insist on running overly high pressures. This rim is a 420-430g race rim not an expedition touring rim nor are we in the era of 18mm tyres pumped up to 9 bar.


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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 10:28 am 
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Ultimobici what's the actual weight of the rims :thumbup:

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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:18 pm 
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sugarkane wrote:
Ultimobici what's the actual weight of the rims :thumbup:

Surprised by this weight since lower than official number. But this has been posted earlier. Image
I would still like to see another source to confirm.


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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:26 pm 
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ultimobici wrote:
I find it amusing that, with all we know about pressures & tyre width, people still insist on running overly high pressures.


What do you call over pressured? There is 5W gain running for example Michelin power comp. at 8.3 over a 5.5bars (or 2 from 5.9 to 8.3) for the 25mm tire.
Image (from http://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/)

Now if you run very wide and stiff tires (27mm or 31 conti 4k for example) the gain is smaller. Image



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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:38 pm 
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ultimobici wrote:
This rim is a 420-430g race rim not an expedition touring rim nor are we in the era of 18mm tyres pumped up to 9 bar.


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I wouldn't qualify a rim that has a minimum tire width of 28mm as a race rim, at least if we're talking about road bikes. It's also a rim that we don't even know if/when 20 and 24 hole variants will show up. 28/32 wheels haven't been race rims in a few decades. At 420-430g it's not going to be particularly well suited for cyclocross (people usually run tubulars anyway) or the gravel market. My questions about max tension were never answered by company when they came here to discuss the rim. :noidea:

I'm going to steer clear of this rim until there's lots of miles on them and the real world gets to abuse them. I just see a potential recipe for less than ideal longevity due to low weight and low max tension. I'd like nothing more than to be proven wrong, always nice to have another rim on the market to work with.

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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:17 pm 
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ergott wrote:
ultimobici wrote:
This rim is a 420-430g race rim not an expedition touring rim nor are we in the era of 18mm tyres pumped up to 9 bar.


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I wouldn't qualify a rim that has a minimum tire width of 28mm as a race rim, at least if we're talking about road bikes. It's also a rim that we don't even know if/when 20 and 24 hole variants will show up. 28/32 wheels haven't been race rims in a few decades. At 420-430g it's not going to be particularly well suited for cyclocross (people usually run tubulars anyway) or the gravel market. My questions about max tension were never answered by company when they came here to discuss the rim. :noidea:

I'm going to steer clear of this rim until there's lots of miles on them and the real world gets to abuse them. I just see a potential recipe for less than ideal longevity due to low weight and low max tension. I'd like nothing more than to be proven wrong, always nice to have another rim on the market to work with.


I'm curious too about the 20h rims.. what's the point of having such a light rims if your wheelset has a minimum spoke count of 24/28? It's 40 an extra grams and then your back at the Easton/HED weight with proper tension limits and really bloody strong rims :roll:

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Last edited by sugarkane on Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:33 pm 
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ergott wrote:
ultimobici wrote:
This rim is a 420-430g race rim not an expedition touring rim nor are we in the era of 18mm tyres pumped up to 9 bar.


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I wouldn't qualify a rim that has a minimum tire width of 28mm as a race rim, at least if we're talking about road bikes. It's also a rim that we don't even know if/when 20 and 24 hole variants will show up. 28/32 wheels haven't been race rims in a few decades.

I know Mavic follow the Etrto regulations (which is surprisingly not always the case by competition) and I wonder if it's possible that the minimum tire width is just linked to the inner rim width. On top of my head I remember (was 12 years ago, so may need to dig in my documentation) a minimum of 1.45 x inner width : 19 x 1.45= 27.55 translated into 28mm.
Now unsure what other brand feel confident to recommend and if there is a risk of mounting the 23-25mm tires.

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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:14 pm 
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I doubt it's a risk putting 25mm tires on there, but then you have to consider if the max pressure is within your preferences. I have no doubt that running tubeless 25mm tires at 80psi would work I just don't think we are still talking about a race rim at that point. If you aren't racing, you are probably more concerned with durability. 420g alloy rims haven't had the best track record in that regard.

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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:14 pm 


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 Post subject: Re: New Mavic Open Pro
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 2:55 am 
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I have a feeling that this new Magic Open Pro will exhibit cracking issue as Pacenti SL23.
Any aluminum rim with modern profile (e.g. wide), that is below 440 grams is not something I'd consider. Hopefully, sidewalls are not as thin as Pacenti SL23.

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