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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:16 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:42 am
Posts: 156
Once again, the question is "Are Enve rims still Made in USA," not "do Enve wheels built with any specific domestic parts qualify them to be able to legally claim that they are made in the USA." Go back and read my post where I transcribed some of the hang tag on a rim.

The FTC repercussions would be irrelevant because if the company perpetrated such a massive lie, there would be no market for Enve's rims. They would instantly go from having, all told, a heck of a lot of credibility to having absolutely completely none. I can't imagine that any single person riding their wheels would continue doing so even for a day because if they straight up explicitly lied about that, what else do they lie about? You wouldn't be able to trust a single thing they say or do or say that they do. And then the FTC would want their pound of flesh.

Enve sure doesn't need me to be defending them on forums, nor do I need to be defending them on forums. We're not even in the carbon wheel business, and until this thread I'd thought myself to be about the biggest cynic alive. No mas for that!

If someone has hard, credible evidence that Enve's consistent explicit statements that they make their rims in the USA are false, I'd encourage him or her to share it. I believe strongly that it would instantly end Enve's business if found to be true. I do not believe such evidence exists, and it would have to pass strong scrutiny.

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Posted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:16 pm 


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:24 pm 
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Posts: 2249
Location: Houston, Texas
Multebear wrote:
I've noticed that "US made" is very important for most Americans.

From my perspective, this is only important in the Enve charges a significant premium in part on that assertion, so I would be significantly less enthusiastic to find out I am paying such a significant markup for outsourced rims.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:53 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 7:48 pm
Posts: 333
Location: NorCal/SoCal
Multebear wrote:
Maybe. I've noticed that "US made" is very important for most americans.



That's why I have 5 Giant bikes.... Oh, wait.... :shock:


I don't care much about where it is made, I do care about how they test and backup the product.

Enve video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9k_G37QG53Y




.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 6:22 pm 
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MoPho wrote:
Multebear wrote:
Maybe. I've noticed that "US made" is very important for most americans.



That's why I have 5 Giant bikes.... Oh, wait.... :shock:


I don't care much about where it is made, I do care about how they test and backup the product.

Enve video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9k_G37QG53Y




.


You should care where its made! Giant is made in Taiwan, the country of bike pioneers. They have dedicated universities for bike industry. Taiwanese take pride in what the do and produce some of the highest quality products.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 6:26 pm 
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Location: NorCal/SoCal
mpulsiv wrote:
You should care where its made! Giant is made in Taiwan, the country of bike pioneers. They have dedicated universities for bike industry. Taiwanese take pride in what the do and produce some of the highest quality products.




Yes, I know. I also have several foreign cars and a Japanese wife, the point was I don't care if it is made in America. Made in USA was perhaps the least thing I cared about when I bought Enve wheels.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 7:41 pm 
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MoPho wrote:
mpulsiv wrote:
You should care where its made! Giant is made in Taiwan, the country of bike pioneers. They have dedicated universities for bike industry. Taiwanese take pride in what the do and produce some of the highest quality products.




Yes, I know. I also have several foreign cars and a Japanese wife, the point was I don't care if it is made in America. Made in USA was perhaps the least thing I cared about when I bought Enve wheels.


"Made in USA" is a big deal to quite a few Americans. Needless to say, they are willing to spend more money and quietly ban outsourcing. Yes, I'm pointing index finger at China. The country that makes anything from condoms to airplanes. The don't specialize in anything.

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:arrow: CBA = Chronic Bike Addiction
:arrow: OCD = Obsessive Cycling Disorder


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 9:12 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:15 am
Posts: 235
mpulsiv wrote:
MoPho wrote:
mpulsiv wrote:
You should care where its made! Giant is made in Taiwan, the country of bike pioneers. They have dedicated universities for bike industry. Taiwanese take pride in what the do and produce some of the highest quality products.




Yes, I know. I also have several foreign cars and a Japanese wife, the point was I don't care if it is made in America. Made in USA was perhaps the least thing I cared about when I bought Enve wheels.


"Made in USA" is a big deal to quite a few Americans. Needless to say, they are willing to spend more money and quietly ban outsourcing. Yes, I'm pointing index finger at China. The country that makes anything from condoms to airplanes. The don't specialize in anything.



Meh. A billion plus people could mean a hell of a lot of specialists.

Out of interest, what is the cut off point in product diversity before one can say a country doesn't specialise?


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 9:43 pm 
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Posts: 17
"Yes, I'm pointing index finger at China. The country that makes anything from condoms to airplanes. The don't specialize in anything".

Now I know what he means by "crap here"


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 10:35 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 10:11 pm
Posts: 856
MoPho wrote:
Multebear wrote:
Maybe. I've noticed that "US made" is very important for most americans.



That's why I have 5 Giant bikes.... Oh, wait.... :shock:


I don't care much about where it is made, I do care about how they test and backup the product.

Enve video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9k_G37QG53Y




.


Not sure what you're implying? That most americans don't care where their products are made?


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2017 4:20 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 7:48 pm
Posts: 333
Location: NorCal/SoCal
mpulsiv wrote:
[

"Made in USA" is a big deal to quite a few Americans.


And then they go out to Walmart and buy cheap crap made in China



Multebear wrote:
Not sure what you're implying? That most americans don't care where their products are made?


That you overstate the importance Americans place on "Made in America". Like you Europeans, most of our stuff is made in Asia too.



.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2017 6:43 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 1:03 am
Posts: 507
Location: Madison, WI USA
I interviewed at for an engineering position at Enve's Ogden office several years ago and saw the rims being made there with my own eyes.

The idea that Enve would lie about making their rims in the US is silly. The risk to their reputation and brand would be enormous, and it would be trivial to expose the truth. Think about it: according to this wacky theory, Enve imports rims, but even after they lay off their layup staff, none of these newly unemployed workers says anything to anyone. The shipping and receiving guy who unpacks the new imported rims and doesn't get the raise he thinks he deserved: this guy doesn't say a word. No one in the factory in Asia says anything. No Enve employee gets a little drunk with an Ogden bike-industry colleague or at Interbike, letting something slip. No one disgruntled because "it just hasn't been the same since MAVIC bought us" complains anonymously to either the industry or consumer press. That's an omerta to put Armstrong to shame.

The simplest explanation is most often the right one. Is it possible that Enve is lying about where it makes its rims? Sure. But such a lie is incredibly risky and easily exposed, all to increase profit on a product that's already profitable. That's way more convoluted than the alternate explanation, which is: Enve hasn't moved production.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2017 7:37 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:42 am
Posts: 156
youngs_modulus wrote:
The simplest explanation is most often the right one. Is it possible that Enve is lying about where it makes its rims? Sure. But such a lie is incredibly risky and easily exposed, all to increase profit on a product that's already profitable. That's way more convoluted than the alternate explanation, which is: Enve hasn't moved production.


Thank you.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2017 9:01 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 1:03 am
Posts: 507
Location: Madison, WI USA
:thumbup:


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2017 5:13 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2011 9:02 pm
Posts: 89
How did country of origin of rims become so important, considering nearly everything else hanging off people's Asian-made frames are made outside the US. Even if you had unlimited funds and tried to specify a bike with a maximum number of parts made in the US, you'd still fall well short. So focusing on rims seems really myopic.


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Posted: Sat Mar 11, 2017 5:13 am 


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2017 5:23 am 
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Posts: 813
Just leaving this here.

https://youtu.be/A8fsKeQwplg


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