are tubulars worth it anymore?

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sawyer
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by sawyer

spectastic wrote:provided the drag and rolling resistance are the same, it shouldn't matter how heavy the wheels are, unless there's another force of resistance that I'm missing.. the lighter wheels will accelerate and slow faster due to the slightly smaller rotational inertia, and vice versa on the heavier wheels.

anyway, the 300 g difference I was asking about was meant more towards acceleration for the final sprint, or an attack (uphill or flat). 300g on the wheels is the same as 300g anywhere else, even on a climb. acceleration =/= climbing. But I guess it's pretty obvious that people agree lighter wheels make the bike feel more nimble for accelerations, whether it's real or placebo.

I guess I'll keep the tubulars..


Hi - 300g at the rim of the wheel will be very slightly harder to accelerate than 300g in the back pocket for example, due to rotational inertia. It will of course, also be harder to decelerate (hold speed "better")

So for the sudden uphill final sprint scenario you refer to, the rim of a wheel is the best place to lose the weight (other than perhaps on the rider)
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bm0p700f
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by bm0p700f

Tubulars are better just because. It's not even a contest. I am running all three tyre types at present.

MRM
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by MRM

Maybe the discussion should be tubular, clincher or tubeless... :wink:

smokva
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by smokva


smokva
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by smokva

[quote="smokva"][/quote]
I don't know what happened with my last post, its empty, can't edit, can't delete.

Anyway... In this thread I see a lot of ignorant theoretic and overstated practical statements.

First practical part...you will not feel few grams of the difference in acceleration or keeping the speed up. Even if you think you can feel it try to measure it and compare your times while riding the same wattage.

In theory there will be difference, but not caused by wheel weight, caused by wheel moment of inertia (aka GD2, inertional mass....) . Lighter wheel can have bigger moment of inertia if more mass is rotating further from the center. So let's not talk apples and oranges. Anyone who knows at least something about electric rotation machines should know about runaway speed, flywheel and similar things. For bicycle wheel same physics apply in regard to how it rotates, accelerates and decelerates.
Anyway, in theory, for a wheel with bigger moment of inertia you need more energy to accelerate it and bring it up to speed, but once it rotates it will keep rotating longer by itself. Wheel with smaller moment of inertia will be easier to accelerate but will require more energy to keep the same speed and will stop by itself before the one with bigger moment of inertia. That's why, in theory at least, weight of tire and tube is the most important since it rotates furthest from the center and influences moment of inertia most. For the same reason I'm not sure heavy tubeless tires with 40g of sealant on the tire are such a good idea if you are concerned about this matter.

laspariahs
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by laspariahs

I don't think that tubulars are worth it, unless you are racing, even then carbon clinchers have come a long way.

fdegrove
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by fdegrove

Hi,

Tubulars are better just because. It's not even a contest. I am running all three tyre types at present.


Whilst I agree you should either explain why you think so or point to a thread that does.

That said, yes, it's one of these "stupid" threads that tend to pop up time and time again, isn't it?

Cheers, ;)
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dj97223
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by dj97223

The answer to the OP is yes, for several reasons.

1. Safety. Safer than clinchers in the event of a flat (and, btw, more likely to keep your rim from getting chewed up when you do get a flat). This "insurance" more than offsets any cost premium paid, in my opinion.

2. Flats. I get fewer flats with tubulars. No worries about base tape, plugs, spoke holes or wandering tubes causing a flat.

3. Comfort. 'Nuff said. OK, it can be closely matched by proper (veloflex) clinchers and latex tubes, but tubulars still get the nod.

4. Weight. What was the name of this website, again?

5. The Art of Cycling. Spending time gluing is dedication to the craft.

Now, let's talk Campagnolo v. Shimano . . . . .
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bm0p700f
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by bm0p700f

folk need to make there own decision really by running all three tyre types try loads of different tyres and clock up enough miles in different conditions and see what right for them. Actually taking advise can confuse matters as everyone has a different opinion. You know mine but the OP if s(he) is on this thread wont know what the answer is.

the thread title should be changed to is this thread worth it anymore?

Sorry but all I am seeing is circles of opinion now.

Harmitc
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by Harmitc

dj97223 wrote:The answer to the OP is yes, for several reasons.

1. Safety. Safer than clinchers in the event of a flat (and, btw, more likely to keep your rim from getting chewed up when you do get a flat). This "insurance" more than offsets any cost premium paid, in my opinion.

2. Flats. I get fewer flats with tubulars. No worries about base tape, plugs, spoke holes or wandering tubes causing a flat.

3. Comfort. 'Nuff said. OK, it can be closely matched by proper (veloflex) clinchers and latex tubes, but tubulars still get the nod.

4. Weight. What was the name of this website, again?

5. The Art of Cycling. Spending time gluing is dedication to the craft.

Now, let's talk Campagnolo v. Shimano . . . . .


The perfect answer! 10/10 [emoji106][emoji106]

Multebear
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by Multebear

dj97223 wrote:The answer to the OP is yes, for several reasons.

1. Safety. Safer than clinchers in the event of a flat (and, btw, more likely to keep your rim from getting chewed up when you do get a flat). This "insurance" more than offsets any cost premium paid, in my opinion.

2. Flats. I get fewer flats with tubulars. No worries about base tape, plugs, spoke holes or wandering tubes causing a flat.

3. Comfort. 'Nuff said. OK, it can be closely matched by proper (veloflex) clinchers and latex tubes, but tubulars still get the nod.

4. Weight. What was the name of this website, again?

5. The Art of Cycling. Spending time gluing is dedication to the craft.

Now, let's talk Campagnolo v. Shimano . . . . .


Are you gluing or taping your tubulars?

How many spare tires do you bring while training?

How do you fix a flat? Sealant or needle and patch kit? How quick can you fix a flat?

How many flats do you approx get a year? Do they use flint when they make roads, where you live?

Hls2k6
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by Hls2k6

Is there any data on cornering limits for a tubular vs. a clincher? In other words, in the case of a similar tire, size & pressure (e.g., Corsa Evo vs. Open Corsa), can a tubular corner further or harder before it gives? I sort of doubt it, but I was wondering if anyone ever actually tested the subject.

davidalone
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by davidalone

I dont think theres any practical difference on cornering limits. if you've glued the tubular correctly, you wil run out of tyre traction far before the tyre/rim interface becomes a problem for both clinchers and tubulars.

Multebear
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by Multebear

Hls2k6 wrote:Is there any data on cornering limits for a tubular vs. a clincher? In other words, in the case of a similar tire, size & pressure (e.g., Corsa Evo vs. Open Corsa), can a tubular corner further or harder before it gives? I sort of doubt it, but I was wondering if anyone ever actually tested the subject.


Unless you are a technical very superior rider, I think your limits will show before the cornering difference between clinchers and tubs will. No offense meant to you. But I think you'll have to be very skilled to experience clinchers holding you back while cornering compared to tubs.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

I'm not going to say I'm outrageously skilled or anything and I don't have any hard data other than first hand experience riding both but without a doubt in my mind I feel more secure on tubulars through corners than on clinchers.
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