Collaborative Design; Rear Road Hub

Everything about building wheels, glueing tubs, etc.
TheDarkInstall
Posts: 723
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 3:44 am

by TheDarkInstall

Hi

This year, I have spent a fair bit of time designing a rear road hub, which has been an enjoyable, problem solving, and learning experience.

I was thinking though; with the amount of decent, knowledgeable people on this forum, has there ever been a bicycle product designed by open collaboration?

It occurred to me, that it could be cool to start some kind of group design effort of a bicycle component, which could eventually, maybe lead to manufacture, and I was wondering if any of you fancied joining me in working on a rear hub design?

Two heads are better than one, and all that, and whenever a product is released, this forum always seems to have very good, considered criticism of it, so I thought the next logical stage of this would be to actually see if we can come up with something ourselves.

I am beast at 3D / Illustrator / Photoshop and like getting really really detailed about mechinical / engineering, etc., so if anyone fancies getting in on some amusing designing, feel free to come along for the ride.

Nice one.

efeballi
Posts: 466
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:50 pm
Location: Body in Milano, mind in Istanbul

by efeballi

I'm in! Have some experience in CATIA and Patran.


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Last edited by efeballi on Sun Jun 29, 2014 4:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
SHUT UP LEGS
2015 Giant Propel Advanced
2013 KTM Strada mod. GOT IT BACK!
2011 Pinarello Dogma 60.1(loaner)
2011 Scott SUB 45(sold)

Politecnico di Milano Ingegneria Meccanica

by Weenie


cajer
Posts: 113
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:26 am

by cajer

I'm interested. Though I'm materials science so not sure how much I could help

cajer
Posts: 113
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:26 am

by cajer

I'm interested. Though I'm materials science so not sure how much I could help

cajer
Posts: 113
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:26 am

by cajer

Triple post somehow...

cajer
Posts: 113
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:26 am

by cajer

Double post

Illuminate
Posts: 404
Joined: Mon May 24, 2010 4:18 am
Location: Australia

by Illuminate

Background in biology so I'm not much use with the design. However, as a heavy weight, I'd happily test the product and give it an absolute caning to try and pick up any shortcomings. Happy to pay for it too. 32h campy if possible :)

efeballi
Posts: 466
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:50 pm
Location: Body in Milano, mind in Istanbul

by efeballi

TheDarkInstall, have you considered designing a matching front hub? Should be a walk in the park after the rear hub and opens up more possibilities if you're thinking of selling it someday.
BTW I'd be more than happy smashing the hub to bits on our pothole-ridden roads and regreasing it every 50 years.


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SHUT UP LEGS
2015 Giant Propel Advanced
2013 KTM Strada mod. GOT IT BACK!
2011 Pinarello Dogma 60.1(loaner)
2011 Scott SUB 45(sold)

Politecnico di Milano Ingegneria Meccanica

TheDarkInstall
Posts: 723
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 3:44 am

by TheDarkInstall

OK great, let's do it then.

I propose the following;

We do this in a few distinct stages, and in order to keep things clear, we do not overlap any of the stages (where at all possible).

Stage One; Brainstorming the design requirements, and theorising all that stuff

Stage Two; Sketching designs, and getting the ball rolling

Stage Three; Narrowing it all down and get things decided.

Stage Four; Working out how to make the thing.

Stage Five; Making the thing, and all that entails (including testing).

How does that sound?

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LouisN
Posts: 2291
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 3:44 am
Location: Canada

by LouisN

Great project guys !!!

Add to this a collaborative light, aero tubular alloy rim project and we have a winner (for me) :beerchug: !!!

Then everyone will only need one wheelset. You'll sell millions :D !!!

Ok. Seriously.

Disclaimer: You really need to figure out A LOT of stuff though. Look what happened to Alchemy Bicycle Works with they're ORC-UL design.

Louis :)

TheDarkInstall
Posts: 723
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 3:44 am

by TheDarkInstall

Stage One

I propose the following. Please add, comment whatever you want, so we can get this started.

-24 hole, 16:8 config.
-Straight pull on NDS
-J-Bend or Straight pull on DS
-Standard bearings; 17mm internal diametre.
-Aluminium or Carbon axle. 17mm
-As simple as possible a pre-load system (think more on the side of Tune, than Extralite, for ease of assembly and serviceability)
-Shoulders on the axle to allow for absolutely mental QR tightness

efeballi
Posts: 466
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:50 pm
Location: Body in Milano, mind in Istanbul

by efeballi

-2:1 lacing or asymmetric hub flanges to balance DS/NDS tension.
-I vote for no carbon inside the hub. Might be easier in the prototype stage but could add extra complexity/cost for very little weight saved.


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SHUT UP LEGS
2015 Giant Propel Advanced
2013 KTM Strada mod. GOT IT BACK!
2011 Pinarello Dogma 60.1(loaner)
2011 Scott SUB 45(sold)

Politecnico di Milano Ingegneria Meccanica

TheDarkInstall
Posts: 723
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 3:44 am

by TheDarkInstall

OK, the 16:8 config is 2:1 lacing on 24h, which is the number of holes I want to go for; 24h is about the sweet spot between going as light as possible, and still being ride-able without worry.

So, we agree on that. Cool.

No carbon in the hub; let's properly explore this before saying a hard no at this point.

cajer
Posts: 113
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:26 am

by cajer

I agree with no carbon axle.
Is a preload system strictly necessary? Many hubs do not have one.
What type of ratchting mechanism will we use? I'm partial to a star ratchet type system due to its simplicity.

Also could we add in some aero touches? Such as streamlined shaping on non rotating parts

by Weenie


TheDarkInstall
Posts: 723
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 3:44 am

by TheDarkInstall

Carbon axle vs. Aluminium axle; please list the benefits / problems with both.

Preload; we need to work out the bearing arrangement to be used before any pre-loading is considered.

Ratchet; list the options; we can always design something original here.

Aerodynamics on non-rotating parts; which non-rotating parts; as far as I can see, a hub is pretty much all rotating.

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