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PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2008 8:36 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 12:24 am
Posts: 15
Location: Michigan, USA
I know that this general topic has been discussed many, many times, but here we go again.

I am trying to decide on tires for my Cervelo R3. I will be riding on Zipp 202 wheels and am wondering what the general opinion is on the Veloflex Roubaix tires is. The roads around here are very bad (rough that is, the best ones are chip sealed) and I am trying to get a comfortable ride with the smallest weight penalty. The Veloflex Roubaix is listed at 270-280 gm which is approximately what a Vittoria CX/Zipp Tangente weighs but has a larger air volume which should lead to a smoother ride. Based on what I have been reading recently it MAY also have a lower real world rolling resistance on the type of roads I ride on.

JIm Stevens


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Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2008 8:36 pm 


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2008 10:36 pm 
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Location: Leiden, NETHERLANDS
Veloflex Roubaix is a very good choice for the lesser good roads.

You should also consider the Challenge Parigi Roubaix:
Look at: http://www.challengetech.it/parisroubaixnero.php

The Challenge real weight is 295-300grams.
The extra grams are mainly due to 3mm wider tyre 27mm and a bit more rubber on tread then on the Veloflex.
Despite only 260tpi the Challenge is a extremely supple tubular.
I recommend this one (even so I don't ride tubular anymore).

You are right about the aspect of rolling resistance.
But tyre freaks know this already for years....

P.S.
Challenge also has a 24mm tubular just called Strada
That one is about the same weight as the Veloflex Roubaix 270-280 real weight.
You should take that one in to consideration too.
Look at: http://www.challengetech.it/strada.php

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:51 am 
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Location: Belgium
Hi,

To me all Veloflex tyres, regardless of them being of the tubular or Open Tubular persuasion, are dry climate (Summer) tyres.
While I have no hands on experience with anything Challenge I feel very confident on Vittoria tubs and Conti Comps on muddy, wet roads.

As it happens I'm often on lousy country roads and the Vittorias (even a 21mm tub) keep on surprising me on how well they track. Much, much better than any Veloflex even though I'm a huge fan of those..On dry roads that is.

Horses for courses, right? :wink:

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 3:06 am 
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Location: New Jersey, USA
With a larger cross section and width comes greater air volume, a suppler casing and more room to absorb impact. The Veloflex would be a great tire, but all Veloflexes deal with the same problem; they wear fast. There isn't too much you can do about it other than inflating them to a higher PSI, but don't expect more than about 2000 miles out of your rear tire.

Other than that, the 22c Criteriums ride like a dream for me, and I would never ride anything else. I can only imagine that the Roubaix would be even nicer. Remember that you can't just put the tire on with Veloflex...you have to center it a bit to get it to sit just right.

Pull the trigger and tell us what you think.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 5:18 am 
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I have a set of the Roubaix's waiting to be mounted right now, as soon as my new wheels get here I plan to try them out myself. They are nice looking tires, I can believe they won't wear great but they do look like they will ride well.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 5:20 pm 
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Location: Michigan, USA
Thanks for the replies.

I have no experience with the Challenge tires, but I looked at their website and found a source here in the US. My only problem with them is appearance, at least for this bike (most definitely a "modern" bike). I want the tire to have a black sidewall. Their Roubaix and Strada tires only come with a brown/tan sidewall, if they were going on my old steel bike (with Mavic 280 rims) they would look perfect! Color is also why I will not use the Vittoria Pave tubular (their Pave clincher is available in all black, so there is hope for the future). I think that a tire with green tread would not look good on a bike with primarily a black and red color scheme.

I am a "fair weather" rider so wet weather tracking is not of great importance.

If I get 2000 miles from the rear tire I would consider that acceptable, indeed quite good. I was not aware that Veloflex tires are not straight, thank you for that insight. The clinchers that I have used were fine. I will be "pulling the trigger" soon but will not be riding them until spring, so the report on my experience will be delayed.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2008 8:08 pm 
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XCrunner49 wrote:
I was not aware that Veloflex tires are not straight, thank you for that insight.


There's always a big difference in straightness and centeredness between tubulars and clinchers, even the same model from the same manufacturer. Think about the construction methods and you'll see why.

However, the issue with Veloflex tubulars isn't about bad alignment on the tires -- they're simply very supple so when mounted the tire doesn't automatically self-center because of stiff construction. Put on a coat of glue, mount the tire, pump it up to 40 psi or so, and you'll be able to adjust orientation quite easily. Then pump it up hard, check it again to be sure it's OK, and let it sit overnight. You'll be quite happy with the result.

Also realize that because the casing is more supple, it's also susceptible to stretching. If you don't start mounting the tire with a decent amount of tension, you'll be stretching the last part tighter which, because it's supple, will cause it to stretch out and become slightly thinner. This creates what looks like a dip in the tire. It's rarely the fault of the tire, but a matter of needing to know how to stretch and mount a tire well.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:19 am 
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Location: Belgium
Hi,

It's rather rare to come across tubulars in the 30 to 50+ euro range that aren't made properly.
Tubulars often get accused of presenting a hump at the valve area, not being straight etc. Where in reality this is often due to the user not mounting the tubular correctly.

Some exceptions notwithstanding, most tubulars are pretty round although perhaps not always as perfect as could be.
Same goes for latex inner tubes, they do need extra attention to mount properly, you do need to check for gunk and no, not just any rim tape will do.

As for the mileage you can get from tubulars, it mainly depends on you.
Tubulars can last a very long time when taken good care of. I've more than a few sets of Veloflex Carbons that have seen the better part of 10.000 km. Honnestly.
They don't even look worn out. It's all about caring for your stuff and knowing how to as well.
Note that those Veloflexes in the example above have seen my nasty needle and thread to repair them but they're stills running as new after that.

I guess you could compare the devotion to the care it takes to keep your old vinyl records in pristine condition.
If it wouldn't take any effort I guess I'd lose interest soon enough.
Guess that's just how I am. 8)

Ciao, :wink:

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:36 am 
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Location: Wherever there's a mountain beckoning to be climbed
fdegrove wrote:
I've more than a few sets of Veloflex Carbons that have seen the better part of 10.000 km. Honnestly.

Front* or rear?

* Mr. Obvious wrote:
Easier to accomplish with front than rear.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:56 am 
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Location: Belgium
Hi,

Both front and rear.
All have been repaired at least once by the master's hand but still going strong.
I'd need to add that they've been treated with Jevelot and Aquasure and are regularly washed with white vinegar (the kind you'd use in the kitchen).
These have been sitting in the cellar for 6 months prior to use. Not saying it has anything to do with, just informing.
No sealant inside whatsoever either. I refuse to use that on such noble tubs anyhow.
If I can repeat the magic, I'll report back. :lol:
.....They're hybernating on the trusty ole Bora's 'till Easter...

Ciao, :wink:

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 4:39 am 
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Location: Michigan, USA
fdegrove,

How often do you use the Jevelot/Aquasure sidewall protectant? Are they used together or interchangeably? Do they have different purposes? What is the purpose of washing with white vinegar? I have seen others say they use it (vinegar) but have not seen an explanation as to why. I will be storing the tires for the winter, not quite 6 months but 4 or so. Do you do the repairs yourself? I have never tried that. I have tried Tufo tape but will be going back to conventional glue (either Continental or Vittoria).


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 8:51 pm 
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Location: Belgium
Hi,

You only apply the coatings once, when the tubular is going to be used.

First you clean/degrease the tyre with a cloth soaked in household vinegar, than you let it dry.
After that you can apply a coat of Jevelot (liquid latex such as Tufo sealant works fine as well) on the sidewall.
Once this layer has solidified (this may take more than a day or two) , you can mount the tubular.
Last you can apply a coat of Aquaure on the sidewalls and cover the small strip of glue between the edge of the rim and the tyre with as well.
This is especially useful for cyclo-cross where bikes see a lot of water and mud.

Succes, :wink:

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 3:19 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 12:24 am
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Location: Michigan, USA
Well, I got my Veloflex Roubaix tires today. The ones I got weigh between 277gm and 286gm (4 tires), pretty consistent. I must say that the tires are more flexible (supple?) than I expected. The clinchers don't feel the same presumably because of the kevlar bead. They seem more flexible than the Zipp Tangente (made by Vittoria) tires I have. Does anyone know who makes the tube (latex?) that Veloflex uses? Is it an extra thin latex tube? It may just be that there is less rubber, the Zipp tires weigh almost the same, 275gm, and are only 21mm wide. At any rate I have two of them stretching on rims and will begin the mounting process in about a week.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 4:52 am 
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Posts: 734
fdegrove wrote:
Hi,

You only apply the coatings once, when the tubular is going to be used.

First you clean/degrease the tyre with a cloth soaked in household vinegar, than you let it dry.
After that you can apply a coat of Jevelot (liquid latex such as Tufo sealant works fine as well) on the sidewall.
Once this layer has solidified (this may take more than a day or two) , you can mount the tubular.
Last you can apply a coat of Aquaure on the sidewalls and cover the small strip of glue between the edge of the rim and the tyre with as well.
This is especially useful for cyclo-cross where bikes see a lot of water and mud.

Aquaseal?


Succes, :wink:


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 10:09 am 
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Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 2:20 am
Posts: 5786
Location: Belgium
Hi,

Aquasure from McNett is what Dugast prescribes but I guess it's quite similar to Aquaseal anyway.

Ciao, :wink:

Image

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Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 10:09 am 


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