24 spoke front wheel - Radial or 2x?

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VTBike
Posts: 412
Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 8:14 pm

by VTBike

Getting a new front wheel built; settled on 24 spokes - HED Belgian Rim, Alchemy ELF hub, Sapim RAY spokes. I'm 195 lbs, like climbing out of saddle, occasional get on some bad roads where I ride in Northern VT. I like the look of radial, but it has been advised that I go 2x spoke cross on the front wheel for purposes of less stress on the hub flange (my rear wheel is 28 spokes w/ 3x). Any opinions to help me make decision? Should I definitely go the 2x -- is it that much more stress on a flange that would cause concern over time?

Thanks for the opinions

mentok
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by mentok

I've just gone through the same decision making process and the bottom line i determined was that so long as the hub flange can handle being laced radially, then there's very few good reasons to go one way or the other:

--rim braked wheels have minimal torsion so there is less need for tangential bracing provided by a cross pattern.
--weight is a pretty minimal concern - less than 1 total spoke difference, so like 4g if you're lucky.
--if you break a spoke on a radially laced wheel then the spoke is free to move. if the wheel is laced with a cross then there are bracing spokes to restrict the movement of the broken spoke.
--there are possibly some aero benefits to radial lacing, but similar to the weight thing this is pretty trivial.
--sheldon reckons that there is more risk of radially laced spokes unwinding
--more spoke tension = more load on the flange - if you're a bigger rider then peak loads on the flange will be higher but this shouldn't be a problem unless you're particularly heavy.

personally, i like the appearance of a radially spoked front, they're super easy to lace up and they're easier to clean so that's the way i've gone.

by Weenie


eric
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by eric

Some hubs will have the bearing pockets go out of round when laced radially. You can lace them 1x to prevent that.

bobqzzi
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by bobqzzi

Crossed is a better deal as the tension of a crossed spoke keeps the one in the load affected zone under tension so it is less likely to unwind

KLabs
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by KLabs

eric wrote:Some hubs will have the bearing pockets go out of round when laced radially. You can lace them 1x to prevent that.

+1 ... I am 209lbs/95 kgs (heavy) and I have run 0x (Radial), 20 spoke, 27mm deep, front wheel without any issues for 3 years (so far) :)

You are lighter but if you want a front wheel that is more bombproof then 1x 24spokes, as suggested by eric, is a good idea ... or even 2x, to be sure :)

eric
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by eric

Troy Watson built me a set of wheels some years back on White H1 hubs. He suggested 1x on the front and I went along with it since he's the expert. Last year I decided to take the wheels apart and use the hubs with some Farsports carbon rims. Researching the H1s I found out about the front sometimes deforming under radial lacing. Now I understood Troy's lacing. I built my wheels the same way.

I kind of like the look so I have done a few other front wheels 1x.

KLabs
Posts: 380
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:29 am

by KLabs

eric wrote:Troy Watson built me a set of wheels some years back on White H1 hubs. He suggested 1x on the front and I went along with it since he's the expert. Last year I decided to take the wheels apart and use the hubs with some Farsports carbon rims. Researching the H1s I found out about the front sometimes deforming under radial lacing. Now I understood Troy's lacing. I built my wheels the same way.

I kind of like the look so I have done a few other front wheels 1x.

Hi eric, probably another idea, when using radial lacing, is to do a triplet arrangement using a 24H hub and a 32H rim ...
... DS/NDS/DS . miss rim hole . NDS/DS/NDS . miss rim hole . DS/NDS/DS . miss rim hole . etc ... sounds interesting.

Do you think this approach might prevent the front rim (sometimes) deforming under radial lacing ... thanks KL :)
Last edited by KLabs on Sat Mar 09, 2013 10:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Mackers
Posts: 480
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2007 2:02 pm

by Mackers

Will look just as stupid as a Vento/Khamsin front wheel and be just as pointless.

fdegrove
Tubbie Guru
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by fdegrove

Hi,

Agreed. Good for a rear wheel where you'd want a more balanced spoke tension. Pointless exercise on a front wheel.

Ciao, ;)
Being a snob is an expensive hobby.

KLabs
Posts: 380
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:29 am

by KLabs

eric wrote:Troy Watson built me a set of wheels some years back on White H1 hubs. He suggested 1x on the front and I went along with it since he's the expert. Last year I decided to take the wheels apart and use the hubs with some Farsports carbon rims. Researching the H1s I found out about the front sometimes deforming under radial lacing. Now I understood Troy's lacing. I built my wheels the same way.
I kind of like the look so I have done a few other front wheels 1x.
fdegrove wrote:Hi,
Agreed. Good for a rear wheel where you'd want a more balanced spoke tension. Pointless exercise on a front wheel.
Ciao, ;)

Hi fdegrove, what would you suggest for the OP's front wheel build, 0x 1x or 2x, and what do you think is causing the effect that eric has indicated :)

I actually like the triplet appearance ... thanks KL :)

fdegrove
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by fdegrove

Hi,

Lots of front hubs are not designed to be laced up radial so I'd take the advise of the manufacturer and opt for at least x1.
x2 lacing will make the wheel stiffer which is a welcome bonus.

http://sheldonbrown.com/wheelbuild.html

http://www.troubleshooters.com/bicycles/wheelbuilding/index.htm

Ciao, ;)
Being a snob is an expensive hobby.

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Liggero
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by Liggero

go radial, but get a stronger spokes, those are too light for you. or go 28.

2x on front is ugly and unnecessary, even if you weight 100Kg. On my track bike i have a 36 spokes front wheel, bomb proof, strong hub and strong spokes, but it's radial. Not going radial on the front is completely out of style and taste. do it only for cobbles or touring or that stuff.
Happy Trails !!!

Orfitinho
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:25 pm

by Orfitinho

The instruction sheet for Alchemy Elf Hubs states that radial pattern is OK for 16H to 28H versions of the hub.

by Weenie


bm0p700f
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by bm0p700f

36 spoke radial wheels look daft to me and so does 1x but its all personal perference.

If the maufacturer warranties the use of radial lacing then use it if they don't use cross lacing 1x or 2x depending on your personal taste.

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