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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:23 pm 
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Make sure you use a lower max tension for the front (120kgf) than the rear (130kgf). The earlier, lighter version can't handle as high a load.


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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:23 pm 


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:28 pm 
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Just as an update, my archetypes arrived today. ERD for both rims was 594. Weights 477g and 480g for 32h, and they are very round out of the box. Have ordered the spokes and looking forward to building them to some 2007 record hubs as a solid traing set. I have put a shimano fulcrum freehub on as I currently have SRAM force on my supersix. I had read and can confirm that fulcrum freehubs are compatible with campag, albeit the shimano freehub is 50g heavier than the original - not an issue for a training set for me, but may concern other ww.


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 7:43 am 
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anyone used veloplugs on archetypes? I'm thinking of a 24/28 bikehubstore archetype build for a 200lb rider.I want to get a build down to sub 1400g and I was considering stans 340s but the tyre blowing off thread damn well put me off! any other recommendations for sub 1400g at my weight? Budget builds please!


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 8:07 am 
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Location: Slovenia---that forest land
Yellow Veloplugs fits in holes

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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 8:28 am 
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Pacenti SL23 with Novatecs, might be over 1400g though

Only other build I can think of would be Kinlin XR-200 with Novatecs, that should be under 1400g

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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 8:45 am 
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XR200: With 24 lasers/ 28 Race,Laser; Novatec hubs are around 1370g

awsome wheelset!

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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 10:40 am 
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I had a rear wheel built for my fixed gear bike with the Archtype rim, DT Revolution spokes and DT alloy nipples and an All City fixed/fixed rear hub. I've been on it about a month and since its a fixed gear no brake to wear down the surface. The wheel performs amazingly. Corners well with tons of grip and a pretty cushy ride too with a Pro4 tire and a Michelin latex tube.

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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 11:55 am 
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Monkeyboy3333 wrote:
anyone used veloplugs on archetypes? I'm thinking of a 24/28 bikehubstore archetype build for a 200lb rider.I want to get a build down to sub 1400g and I was considering stans 340s but the tyre blowing off thread damn well put me off! any other recommendations for sub 1400g at my weight? Budget builds please!

The only way to get sub 1400g set on the Archetype is to use previous rim's version (450g) and some lighter hubs, than these ones you can find on BHS web.
My set: rims 450g/452g, hubs Tune 70/170 74g/176g, spokes Cx-ray 24/28 radial/3x 112g/134g, alu nipples 8g/10g with washers 4g/5g, total 1424g.

With your weight (similar to mine) I wouldn't bother to take into consideration the rims such as XR200. Too flimsy for that weight range.
I built a set of IRD cadence (sub 400g) two seasons ago, so I got quite good comparison between these two rims.
Archetype is much stiffer, the ride is more stable, lower pressure = more comfy, 23mm makes difference.
So I would recommend you to stay within 23mm rims as a really good choice, even you finish your build with 100g more than anticipated, the quality of the ride and robustness of the wheel will overcompensate it. But of course it also depends on what the rims will be laced to.

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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 5:08 pm 
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1415chris, thanks for your input, there's definitely something v attractive about trying the wider rim for a cushy ride. At 200lbs I need to lose weight before the wheels, that said this is WW after all. Anything will beat the 1849g Fulc 7's that came with my new Wilier. They are destined for the winter muck.


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PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 9:52 am 
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Hi All,

I am wondering if somebody could shed some light on a problem I had with a newy built (by me) wheelset using the Archtype rims.

A little history first ... I am a newbie wheel builder, building mostly for myself and a few wheelsets for friends, maybe 20 sets over the last 18 months so not complete noob but also nowhere near experienced.

All wheesets I have built to date have remained very straight and true, the first set required a little tweaking after a few rides but all others since have remained tight and good.

The set I built up (my only clincher wheelset, I always run tubs) are Archtype rims on Royce hubs, mid flange front, Nemesis for Campag rear. The front and rear are both built 28 hole 3 cross (I am 210lbs), front tensioned to 120kg, rear drive side are 130kg.

Now, the problem. Whilst I mostly used my other wheelsets for road riding I decided to run these on a recent hilly sportive (160km and 3000m of climbing, mixed surface roads, mostly good with the occaisional bumpy to badly pot holed). I was advised by the event organisers beforehand that due to the heavy rain in the area earlier the week before the roads on the route would likely be awash with small flints and the risk of puncturing would be high. So I decided to shod the new wheels in 28mm Conti 4 Seasons rubber and carry a few spare tubes in the fear that I would be saving my FMB's for a better day !!! I never punctured !!!

Had no problems during the ride, the odd heavy bang into an unseen pot hole but no major worries. No brake rub or signs of any problems. Only when I gave the bike a good clean did I notice that one of the rear non-drive side spokes had de-tensioned completely, Although it did not hugely affect the shape of the wheel it clearly needed fixing before any further mileage would be put to the wheels.

Now, my question is, what did I do wrong ??? Is the build not up to scratch (I think so) ... Was I unlucky ??? Shoudl I have used a thread locker when building (not used on any other wheelsets) ... Did I over inflate my tyres (100 front, 105 rear) causing more detension of the spokes enough so that the riding / pot holes (not many in 160kms) cause the further loosening ??? I have noticed that when building a clincher wheelset and inflating the tyres to pressure this reduces the spoke tension quite considerably.

My worry is that I would like to use this particular wheelset for long Audax events and I don't want to re-building on the road. Could the lacing pattern be changed to make the balance between DS and Non-DS spoke tension more even ???

All advise is greatfully appreciated since I have only built a few clincher wheelsets and worry that my skills are not up to scratch, although tubular builds have all remained straight.

Many thanks guys (and girls)


Simon.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 4:05 am 
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@simonhi- Did you use spoke prep on the threads? A lack of spoke prep can cause nipples to unwind quickly.

Another possibility would be a lack of stress relief. If you don't seat the nipples completely through stress relieving they can go slack.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 4:25 am 
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Simon... we need to see the pertinent details of the build and the rider. Spokes (and #), hub dimensions, tensions, lube, building procedure, rider weight, etc.

Yes, something isn't right... but it could be caused by a lot of things.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 12:32 pm 
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Zen Cyclery wrote:
@simonhi- Did you use spoke prep on the threads? A lack of spoke prep can cause nipples to unwind quickly.

Another possibility would be a lack of stress relief. If you don't seat the nipples completely through stress relieving they can go slack.


Been a while getting back to this one guys, can't seem to stay logged in on an iPad for some strange reason ???

Anyway, in response, spoke prep way a little dab of oil on the spoke threads and nibble / rim hole interface. Have always done this and had no problems. I am loathed to use a thread locker as I think that a well built wheel should not need to be chemically held together.

Stress reflief was not required since there is no spoke wind-up (I used CX-Rays). I did use a spoke punch to properly seat the spokes in the spoke holes on the hubs but then this too is just a tap to confirm that the spoke is home.

WMW wrote:
Simon... we need to see the pertinent details of the build and the rider. Spokes (and #), hub dimensions, tensions, lube, building procedure, rider weight, etc.

Yes, something isn't right... but it could be caused by a lot of things.


Build is 28 hole 3 cross front, and rear DS and Non-DS, the same as my Ambrosio Nemesis with the same hubs. Rider (Me) is 210lbs, not what I would call strong, max power output 350watts, avaerage over a 4-5 hour ride is 160-175W. More a masher than a spinner, average cadence tends ot be 80-85 ish.

Spokes were CX-rays, tightended front to 110kg, rear DS to 130kg. Hubs are Royce Mid flange front, Nemesis rear (Campag).

This is the third wheelset I have built with the same hubs, first two used Nemesis rims, one set has CX-rays, one set has DT Competition. Neither wheelset has moved since the day built them, accept this set where I have used Archetype rims.

I know it is not the rims, since there are so many good things being writtem by wheelbuilders and users of the rims alike.

I can only think that maybe the wheelbuild was a bit sloppy and not quite right, I don't think the drives side could have been any better and in fact it was the Non-DS spoke that loosened.

Maybe I did not have even spoke tension on Non-DS ???

All advice is good advice, especially from those that have built a few good sets of wheels and maybe encountered the sam as me.

Many thanks guys.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 5:21 pm 
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Simonhi wrote:
Stress reflief was not required since there is no spoke wind-up (I used CX-Rays).


Doh! Those are two different things. Stress relief is most definitely needed.

Quote:
Maybe I did not have even spoke tension on Non-DS ???


That is important also.

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Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 5:21 pm 


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 8:33 am 
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WMW wrote:
Simonhi wrote:
Stress reflief was not required since there is no spoke wind-up (I used CX-Rays).


Doh! Those are two different things. Stress relief is most definitely needed.

Quote:
Maybe I did not have even spoke tension on Non-DS ???


That is important also.


When you said stress relief I thought you were referring to spoke wind-up, which is very visible and avaoidable on a bladed spoke.

Realising now that you mean ( I think ) setting the spoke path (required more for head in spokes bending over the hub flange) I can't be sure that I did that, since the wheelset was built over six months ago and sat in a bag until a few weeks ago.

I have rebuilt the affected wheel and will ride it this weekend to see whether the rebuild has held up.

Is there a minimum spoke tension you would be worried about going below on the non-DS ???

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