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PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2014 1:31 am 
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Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:57 am
Posts: 71
dereksmalls wrote:
Not brought anything of Alibaba so don't know what these would be like, anyone got any experience with this supplier or these rims? 210gram 20mm 20 hole tubulars from X-Bike

http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Bicycle-super-light-carbon-road-rim_431130092.html?s=p


Those foam-filled rims from "X-bike" have bad reputation on the web. You can also refer to the Farsports thread, in the earlier posts there are reports of these rims' failures:
http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=87659&start=45
http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=87659&start=60

Farsports used to sell rims from X-bike, but not anymore. X-bike's weight is very impressive, but apparently it's beyond the manufacturer's capability to make such lightweight rims without compromising strength and durability.


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Posted: Mon Mar 24, 2014 1:31 am 


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2014 7:56 am 
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Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 9:20 pm
Posts: 1146
Location: New Zealand
Thanks for the heads up. I'll steer clear then, prefer something that will at least hold up to the demands placed on it.

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2012 BMC SLR 6.02kg http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=110390


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:37 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 6:58 am
Posts: 776
Location: 604
OK I am done with carbon clinchers for now.

I had a brake track deform on the rear rim of my Light-Bicycle 45mm (303 clones). It was subtle but noticeable to the touch and eye and obviously a safety concern. L-B was very good and after a few very civil emails I had a new rim within a few weeks and was out $40 for shipping but did not have to send the defective rim back. This is the second set of carbon clinchers from different manufacturers I've had an issue with in a row so I am feeling jaded. These were on a winter bike that saw no sustained braking so very disappointing. That on the back of a failed set of 50mm clinchers from farsports last summer. I think carbon clinchers are simply fundamentally flawed unless you live in an area where sustained braking is not required. I am sure many of you have had great experiences as I did for some time, but for now I am going to stick to tubulars for the carbon rims. For the record I've had 6 sets of wheels from farsports, L-B, and Yishun over the last 4 years.

Not trying to bash anyone. Just wanted to share my experience with carbon clinchers and farsports/L-B. Both companies will work with you to make it right if you do have issues. I really think there are issues with the technology and that applies to all carbon clinchers.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:46 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 9:47 pm
Posts: 1628
Location: Santa Cruz, California, USA
Which models and years (since FarSports changes rims and keeps the same model)?

What brake pads were you using?

Thanks!


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:00 am 
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Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:12 am
Posts: 157
@petepeterson, am sorry to hear of your experience. It certainly comes up that there are issues with brake tracks on these rims. Even from the more reputable of these (arguably) second-class manufacturers. I don't know if the big brands suffer from the same issues still (marketing claims they don't), but this concern contributed to my decision to switch to a disc-brake road bike, though the regular/non-catastrophic braking performance was also a chief motivator. Certainly building a disc-brake wheelset made the decision to use LB rims (over more expensive) much more comfortable.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 5:59 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 6:58 am
Posts: 776
Location: 604
I had the older narrow V section clinchers "w/basalt" from farsports. Bought them fall of 2012 had issues summer of '13.

Yes... I think when you take braking on clincher rims out of the equation these are still great option. I've had 3 sets of tubular rims from china with zero issues. Even though I've now had issues I still recommend L-B or farsports to friends if they are ordering tubulars. I may even order a set of L-B MTB rims for myself.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 4:34 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2011 8:09 pm
Posts: 680
Farsports, the narrow carbon, and the foam filled have all had issues.

Surprised to hear Light Bicycle had some issues with the 45mm.

I personally only have about 2000+ft of climbing on our Sunday ride course, but our climbs/descents are short/punchy...no long extended braking required, hence, any carbon clincher would have no problems where we live with over heating, just isn't possible.

If you are going to ride bigger descents/climbs, I wouldn't run carbon clincher, tubulars only, like the Pros...no issues with those ever.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 6:34 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 9:47 pm
Posts: 1628
Location: Santa Cruz, California, USA
its not the size or the steepeness of the descents that's the problem. it's the amount of braking for tight turns.

I've done steep 6000' descents in the sierras that hardly require braking because one can take the turns at 55mph. But a technical descent with tight turns that require braking hard from 30 mph to 15 over and over will put a lot of heat into the rims. The low speeds reduce heat loss to convection.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 7:40 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:07 pm
Posts: 20
Location: Vancouver
Image
The bike and the HongFu wheels after a post-race bath.

Mini review of my HongFu 56mm depth x 27mm wide tubular wheelset that arrived in March, 2014. I've only done one ride on them: a hilly, wet, dirty and hard-riding (though smooth surface) 112km road race. My comparison is to a previous set of 2011 Zipp 808 tubulars, 2013 Specialized Roval 60mm clinchers, and some stock aluminum Fulcrum clinchers. Rode them on a stock, new 2014 Tarmac SL4 Expert (though I never tried the 808s on the Tarmac, I did try the Rovals and the Fulcrums). I'm riding very similar tubulars to what the 808s had: Corsa CX 25mm ISO compound (vs. my older Corsa Evo CX 23mm tubs). I do believe it's 90% psychosomatic feeling small differences in equipment—tires and pressure have the largest bearing—so take the following with that in mind. In the end I want wheels that at least try to be aero, durable and all-around reliable race machines.

Short story
Wheels feel great, feel fast, tension seems even, they're still true. Some potential water damage / roughness in cassette body bearings, though. But overall worth the $600 CDN all-in price.

Image
After a hose spray, but before soap washing: example of only some of the grit that accumulated in the race.

Long story
The weekend's race was wet and dirty with slight (20–30kph) crosswinds. Lots of winter road grit and sand and a fairly fast descent, with some moderate braking on two sharp corners, and a very steep 2-3 minute switch back climb and lots of race attacks and 100% accelerations. Smooth roads for the most part. After 10km of racing I had full confidence in them, and pushed them harder and harder in the corners as the race went on. Was glad to have them while pulling and attacking the breakaway.

Image
After a wash, a view of the braking surface. Looks fine, felt fine.

Positive: braking felt good: no pulsing, no roughness, no squealing. Slightly better than my previous Zipp 808s. Was using Swissstop yellow carbon-specific pads (with previous wear on them) instead of the stock no-name pads the wheels shipped with. Depth of the rims seemed ideal for the conditions: I'll race these in any condition. Wind up and sprinting was good. Even used the suspiciously light skewers and seemed fine. Whole wheelset shaved nearly 1-pound over the stock Fulcrum training wheels. Front hub still felt super smooth after the race. Rim shows very little wear after a fair bit of dirty grit braking. Minimal water accumulation inside the rims after.

Negative: did notice some flex in the rear with some brake rub when attacking out of the saddle on the climb. Could run the brakes a bit more open, but not much more open. I had the same rub, though slightly less, with my old 808s, too, though don't notice it with the Rovals. Need more tape on the front valve extender to keep it from knocking like a metronome in the rim valve hole while riding. The rear hub axle bearings felt somewhat rough to the touch two days after the race. Pulled the caps and cassette body off and it felt smooth again, and pinpointed the roughness to the cassette body bearings. Not impressed with the seals, though which seal is weak is harder to determine: the cassette-body-to-hub-flange seal, or the outboard cassette body seal near the cassette lock ring? Gonna be difficult getting at those bearings to either repack or replace. Note the hubs are "Chosen" brand. Finally, felt a very slight give to the freehub the first few jumps on it: inspection shows very little 'dig' in the aluminum splines of the cassette body, so maybe it was settling in, and / or the pawls settling in.

Image
Front wheel weight of 939g, including Corsa CX 25c tubular, valve extender, and stock skewers. No glue (maybe add 15g for glue).

Image
Rear wheel weight of 1085g, including Corsa CX 25x tubular, valve extender, and stock skewers. No glue (maybe add 15g for glue).


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2014 8:23 am 
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Formerly known as wassertreter

Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 8:08 am
Posts: 1834
Location: Pedal Square
Zigmeister wrote:
If you are going to ride bigger descents/climbs, I wouldn't run carbon clincher, tubulars only, like the Pros...no issues with those ever.

Not into carbon clinchers myself, but Reynolds claims Ag2r was using them for the better part of the TdF back then.

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Bikes: Raw Ti, 650b flatbar CX


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2014 10:34 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 03, 2010 6:20 am
Posts: 324
Such a nice write up. Cheers!


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2014 1:27 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:23 am
Posts: 304
wassertreter wrote:
Not into carbon clinchers myself, but Reynolds claims Ag2r was using them for the better part of the TdF back then.


Ag2r had carbon clinchers at the 2012 Tour of California too.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:14 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:07 pm
Posts: 20
Location: Vancouver
wynkendeword wrote:
The rear hub axle bearings felt somewhat rough to the touch two days after the race. Pulled the caps and cassette body off and it felt smooth again, and pinpointed the roughness to the cassette body bearings. Not impressed with the seals, though which seal is weak is harder to determine: the cassette-body-to-hub-flange seal, or the outboard cassette body seal near the cassette lock ring? Gonna be difficult getting at those bearings to either repack or replace.


Update on my rear hub / freehub body issue. After my single ride / race on it, I pulled the freehub body off (also sometimes called the cassette body, in case you're googling) and, using a socket and hammer, tapped the two no-name cartridge bearings out. And they felt fine and relatively smooth on their own.

Also inside the freehub body are two spacers of equal width but in two diametres: one to match the outside bearing race diametre, and one to match the inside race diametre. Funny thing is that while the larger diametre spacer seats itself inside the freehub body, the inside one just seems to sit on the inner races by manual alignment. I pressed the bearings and spacers back in (with a home-made bolt-washer-wingnut press) in the proper order: cartridge bearing, outer with nested inner spacer, second cartridge bearing, rubberized c-clip. Put the freehub body back on, tighten the end cap and…rough again. Unreasonably rough.

Tap them out again, try again, this time not fully pressing the unit in with the press…re-assemble the whole hub and they are smooth this time.

My theory is that the tolerances are a bit low on these and, if the bearings-and-spacers are pressed ~0.1mm in too far, the axle end cap presses / rubs on the freehub body itself a bit, instead of solely pressing it's small lipped flange on the inner race of the bearing cartridge. By having the bearing protrude ~0.1mm (it's definitely less than a mm, anyways) it seats properly. I think. The question is: how did it become rough after one ride?

Will likely learn more next weekend when I race them again.

Image
Pressing the bearings and spacers back in.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:26 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2011 3:42 pm
Posts: 51
Anyone with experience of the new u-shaped 50mm carbon clinchers from farsports?
Same rims as LB?
Pretty impressive weight with the edhubs option


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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:26 pm 


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 11, 2014 10:13 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2011 11:33 pm
Posts: 5
bump
cth wrote:
There seem to be many positive reviews of the 45mm x 27mm U-shaped rims from Light Bicycle. Does anyone here have the 50mm or 90mm deep versions (not listed outright on their website)?...Thoughts? ...Weights?


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