XTR RD-M960 with ST-M952 compatibility

[Mulle]

Hi,
As some of you know I still want a lighter rear derailleur.
Now I got this idea og combining my good old 2002 XTR Shift-/Brakeunit with one of the new 2005 XTR Rear derailleur.

Right now I still have the 2002 XTR Rear derailleur.
To my riding style: I ride hard cross-country. Lots of up and down.

One thing by the way: No way am I going to shift to dual-control ! I hate it to say the least.

Well and now to get to the point of my question:
My problem is I found nowhere telling me that they are compatibel with each other.
(1) So, how will the shifting with the old STI combined with the new rear derailleur be?
(2) Is the new rear derailleur inverse or something?
(3) Is the springtension-different because of the dual-control compatibility?
(4) Is the shifting upwards (small cog to larger cog) made by the rear derailleur-spring or by the cable tension. (Edit: Just found out this is called having rapid-rise - or not - So does it have "rapid-rise" ?)

(5) Or is it (as I hope) totally "normal" shifting just like with the old rear derailleur?

Now that's the first part of the question, the second thing is:
(6) How can it be, that the old XTR rear derailleur has 25g (ww-listings) weightdifference between SGS and SG (lond and short cage) and the new XTR rear derailleur only has 9g (official) difference and only 2-3g in the ww-listings?

[Frankie - B]

(1) So, how will the shifting with the old STI combined with the new rear derailleur be?

this will be "inverse/ "Rapid Rise" so index finger wil shift a lower gear.

(2) Is the new rear derailleur inverse or something?

Yes

(3) Is the springtension-different because of the dual-control compatibility?

Don't know, but i think it won't be different.

(4) Is the shifting upwards (small cog to larger cog) made by the rear derailleur-spring or by the cable tension. (Edit: Just found out this is called having rapid-rise - or not - So does it have "rapid-rise" ?)

this is done by the spring in the rear mech. it pushes outwards instead of puling in.

(5) Or is it (as I hope) totally "normal" shifting just like with the old rear derailleur?

No this will be "inverse" or "rapid rise"

[carsten_thies]

[quote]
(6) How can it be, that the old XTR rear derailleur has 25g (ww-listings) weightdifference between SGS and SG (lond and short cage) and the new XTR rear derailleur only has 9g (official) difference and only 2-3g in the ww-listings?[/quote]

The 952 SGS has a steel inner cage plate, the 952 SG and both 960s have Al inner cage plates.

[Tippster]

Why not run a Dura Ace 7800 rear mech. The limiting factor being the need to get a road cassette. Could you live with 44/32/22 x 12-27 ?

DA 7800 is 180g stock. Strip off the barrell adjuster (I use the adjusters on my XT shifters) and you have a rear mech weighing 176g!

[Mulle]

Thanks for the answers fox.

@carsten_thies
Logical explanation, couldn't be a easier answer

@Tippster
I thought about the DA r.d. but I don't like the silver-look on my almost all black (stealthy) MTB but is the DA r.d. "rapid rise / invers" too ? And I ride 46/36/24 and DA 12-27. But thought about the a set of 44/34 rings too... So you got my attention

@All (Yeah that means YOU too )
Two more questions to the XTR, concluded from your (or preciser said: Frankie - B's) answers:
(1) Is the spring tension strong enough to shift under load in the hills?
(2) How "fast" (realvite <= what do you feel it like) does it shift let's say 4 cogs in a row when under load too?

The reason for the (2)'nd question is because when riding down a steep hill and then at once going up too is has to shift fast enough to be able to apply power all the time and not having to "apply lesser strenght" for the rear derailleur to shift properly.

[Frankie - B]

(1) Is the spring tension strong enough to shift under load in the hills?
(2) How "fast" (realvite <= what do you feel it like) does it shift let's say 4 cogs in a row when under load too?

Spring tension on the olders models felt good and works properly. The idea is a great one!

Well, that should be as fast as you are used to know. only, you are working the trigger in stead of the thumb lever

I think it is the best shimano invention ever!

[Tippster]

@Tippster
I thought about the DA r.d. but I don't like the silver-look on my almost all black (stealthy) MTB but is the DA r.d. "rapid rise / invers" too ? And I ride 46/36/24 and DA 12-27. But thought about the a set of 44/34 rings too... So you got my attention

DA 7800 performs opposite to rapid rise. I'm running XT shifters. Pushing forwards with the thumb shifter moves the chain up to a larger cog. using the trigger with your finger, drops the chain to a smaller cog.

I'm running my DA7800 rear mech with a PC99 hollowpin chain (Ideal would be 10 speed KMC-X10), XT 48/36/26 crankset, DA 11-23 cassette (Need to switch to 12-27 for off-road) and XT shifters. I run a lot of road miles, hence the 48T front ring.

[Mulle]

DA 7800 performs opposite to rapid rise. I'm running XT shifters. Pushing forwards with the thumb shifter moves the chain up to a larger cog. using the trigger with your finger, drops the chain to a smaller cog.

I'm running my DA7800 rear mech with a PC99 hollowpin chain (Ideal would be 10 speed KMC-X10), XT 48/36/26 crankset, DA 11-23 cassette (Need to switch to 12-27 for off-road) and XT shifters. I run a lot of road miles, hence the 48T front ring.

Well now you really have my attention, but I need the slightly heavier GS version.

Please take a look at
http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum ... a3d7#39859
too......

Thanks so far.