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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:53 am 
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Location: Sweden
So, what are currently the lightest 29" bikes in the world? Seems like no one or very few is really pushing it these days?

Most curious about hardtails with a "real" fork with damping (as in not Laufs or rigids etc) but please post anything, full suspension or hardtail.

So far these are pretty much the only ones I know of, have you guys seen any others?

Sörensen Sykler / Open with rigid fork at 6.09kg w/o pedals, MaxxLite tires:
Image

Stock AX Lightness Vial Evo XC at 6.92kg w/o pedals, Furious Fred tires:
Image

Also Open had some light builds back in 2013 at 6.4kg with rigid fork and 6.7 with Lauf, w/o pedals and with Furious Fred tires.
http://reviews.mtbr.com/eurobike-2013-w ... r-hardtail

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:33 pm 
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Add another 1000g for real tires, pedals and bottle cage(s) and that bottom bike is something that is actually something you can ride on MTB trails.

The reason no one is "pushing it" these days is because no one wants to be pushing their bike up hills when they flat an ultralight tire or slide out on a less-than perfectly maintained corner. Simply put, people have realized where "stupid light" and "light" diverge, and people are favoring light-but-reliable these days.


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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:33 pm 


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 10:02 pm 
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LeDuke wrote:
Simply put, people have realized where "stupid light" and "light" diverge, and people are favoring light-but-reliable these days.


Definitely +1 for this. I see no reason to push hardtail 29er under 8 or even under 9kg. I think that 8kg is very light race machine if you realy have to trust your bike to get the whole race trough. In every day use under 9kg is very light. I ride 9,6kg canyon exceed and that is built with decent weight parts but more like every day reliable bike. I could squeeze it under 9kg pretty easily but I like how comfortable an reliable it is now. Even pro cyclists 29er bikes weight about 9kg.

Edit. And yes I know that with extralite, schmolke, etc you can build 7kg hardtails but like I said reliability is the word.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2016 2:05 am 
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I really can agree with that, hence why I wrote down the lack of pedals and what tire model because I too find those tires a bit stupid and same thing with the no pedals thing. Sure, what tires you think you can actually get away riding with is up to the rider but personally I draw the line at Thunder Burts depending on the terrain.

I didn't necessarily mean go full on Gunter Mai when I wrote pushing it, but when it comes to mtb you don't really even see any light builds at all with readily available parts. Many bikes with a few really lightweight components, but almost never anyone doing it all the way. Compare that to road bikes and there's plenty of very light builds that seem to be ridden quite a bit and being reliable for daily use.

Juuzo, just so I don't get lost in translation, do you mean that Schmolke, Extralite etc aren't reliable enough?

I built a 7,97kg (with pedals and cage haha) Scale with a Sid, XX1 and Tufo XC2's back in 2014, hated the tires and later rode with Dugasts or alu clinchers so the weight was around 8,2-8,3 depending on setup. Not a single broken part in 3 years of riding, and since that wasn't a very special or boutique build I always thought you could cut quite a bit of weight if cost wasn't an issue and still have a reliable bike.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 6:00 am 
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Gullholm wrote:
Juuzo, just so I don't get lost in translation, do you mean that Schmolke, Extralite etc aren't reliable enough?


No, I mean that those are definitely top quality parts and you can build really light weight bike with those but personally I wouldn't risk any reliability just for few grams. Nothing is more annoying than squeeking seatpost or handlebar or skewers. I have seen 6g seatpost collars broken in races and thats about it your race is over. With 12g collar you could get it last. So in mountainbike I don't just see the benefit.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 6:59 pm 
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The issue with the Schmolke end of the spectrum is that the inevitable crashes become even more expensive. Don't race what you can't replace :)


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 9:52 pm 
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juuzo wrote:
No, I mean that those are definitely top quality parts and you can build really light weight bike with those but personally I wouldn't risk any reliability just for few grams. Nothing is more annoying than squeeking seatpost or handlebar or skewers. I have seen 6g seatpost collars broken in races and thats about it your race is over. With 12g collar you could get it last. So in mountainbike I don't just see the benefit.


Thanks for the clarification! Berk integrated saddle/seatpost/stem/handlebar combos along with thru-axles, just saying. :wink: I see your point though, and of course everyone draws their line wherever they choose to do. As in what is worth it and what's not, sucks to have a ride/race ruined like that.


DanW wrote:
The issue with the Schmolke end of the spectrum is that the inevitable crashes become even more expensive. Don't race what you can't replace :)


Hey this is weightweenies, cost and crashes shouldn't even be discussed. :lol: :beerchug: Seriously though, worst case scenario is that you replace it with something cheaper for a while at least haha.


Well I got a 2017 Scale SL frame coming in december, which is one reason why I got curious about what bikes are out there. We'll se what I can do, spec is already getting kinda wild so sub 6.8kg with a FOX 32SC, Thunder Burts, pedals and bottle cage is the goal at the moment.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:52 am 
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Gullholm wrote:
juuzo wrote:
No, I mean that those are definitely top quality parts and you can build really light weight bike with those but personally I wouldn't risk any reliability just for few grams. Nothing is more annoying than squeeking seatpost or handlebar or skewers. I have seen 6g seatpost collars broken in races and thats about it your race is over. With 12g collar you could get it last. So in mountainbike I don't just see the benefit.


Thanks for the clarification! Berk integrated saddle/seatpost/stem/handlebar combos along with thru-axles, just saying. :wink: I see your point though, and of course everyone draws their line wherever they choose to do. As in what is worth it and what's not, sucks to have a ride/race ruined like that.


DanW wrote:
The issue with the Schmolke end of the spectrum is that the inevitable crashes become even more expensive. Don't race what you can't replace :)


Hey this is weightweenies, cost and crashes shouldn't even be discussed. :lol: :beerchug: Seriously though, worst case scenario is that you replace it with something cheaper for a while at least haha.


Well I got a 2017 Scale SL frame coming in december, which is one reason why I got curious about what bikes are out there. We'll se what I can do, spec is already getting kinda wild so sub 6.8kg with a FOX 32SC, Thunder Burts, pedals and bottle cage is the goal at the moment.


I'd argue that the "worst case scenario" is that you crash on it, think everything is fine, and then you crash again. Gunn-Rita Dahle Flesja has crashed out of at least two World Cup races when her super light bars broke under her.

I ride in places where not only would breaking a bar put me in the hospital, it would possibly result in my death. Places like Moab and St. George, UT, where several hundred meter high cliff faces are part and parcel of many normal XC trails.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 7:40 am 
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I always wonder where and what the guys that run rigid forks with 1.9 semi slick tires ride.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 11:15 am 
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DanW wrote:
Well I got a 2017 Scale SL frame coming in december, which is one reason why I got curious about what bikes are out there. We'll se what I can do, spec is already getting kinda wild so sub 6.8kg with a FOX 32SC, Thunder Burts, pedals and bottle cage is the goal at the moment.


That's a nice looking frameset. Please post pictures and weight once you get it built.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 11:20 am 
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LeDuke wrote:
I'd argue that the "worst case scenario" is that you crash on it, think everything is fine, and then you crash again. Gunn-Rita Dahle Flesja has crashed out of at least two World Cup races when her super light bars broke under her.

I ride in places where not only would breaking a bar put me in the hospital, it would possibly result in my death. Places like Moab and St. George, UT, where several hundred meter high cliff faces are part and parcel of many normal XC trails.


Of course, that goes without saying. My answer was to that it would be a problem to replace expensive high end parts.
Everything can break, however I personally would trust a Schmolke bar made "as strong as possible" more than a "cheap" Procraft bar at the same weight (that the Merida riders use) or some other cheap carbon.
But like I said earlier, everyone draw their line where they choose to and you should always feel like you trust your bike. :beerchug:

Still, lots of people running MCFK/Tune/etc and to some extent Extralite/Schmolke/etc on mtb builds which makes the "too unreliable"-argument kind of go out the window but very few are really going lightweight all the way compared to roadies.


stoney wrote:
That's a nice looking frameset. Please post pictures and weight once you get it built.


Will do! I'll get a build thread going when it gets here.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 6:48 pm 
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It's not really a case of trust. If you have a heavy crash then the sensible thing to do is replace the wafer thin CF parts, even if there isn't any visible damage, regardless of brand. Parts are designed to operate in normal conditions not remain functional after a crash. The cost/ weight ratio is exponential and there is a reason the MT Zoom/ KCNC style components are popular. Of course if you don't race then crashes seem to be less likely but I still don't want to shell out a ton of £££ when I barely clip a tree and put a crack in the end of the bars a good few inches long :beerchug: I guess many are the same

I think LeDuke makes a really good point in that the trails we expect to ride on an "XC" bike have really stepped up in difficulty and consequence in recent years and the demands on components have changed with this.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 1:25 am 
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Getter wrote:
I always wonder where and what the guys that run rigid forks with 1.9 semi slick tires ride.
\

The same place people ride CX bikes at... People ride pretty gnarly trails on cross bikes, so having a wide flat bar 29er with 1.9 - 2.4 tires will get you through those kind of trails more comfortably..I'm getting a custom rigid 29er (Boost spacing) and the option to fit 2.4 tires. Gonna be my local LA trail shredder. If I find myself getting into some gnar, I'll spring for a full squish MTB.

I was kind of looking up to to this thread for build inspiration. I wanted to go THM M3 on my rigid, but I just can't help think that's a dumb idea riding over rocks and the occasional low side on a MTB. Nothing like scratched up THM cranks on your new build.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 2:21 am 
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Only place I've seen CX bikes are on fire roads. The last guy I saw take a CX bike to some Sycamore Canyon singletrack had to be extracted by a park ranger.

I see lots of these "weight weenie" MTB builds go with a rigid forks and semi slicks just for the sake of hitting a low weight.


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Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 2:21 am 


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 3:54 am 
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This is light ?

http://www.bikeradar.com/au/mtb/gear/ar ... ike-46956/


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