10spd XTR with SS cage / Saint with GS cage

Discuss light weight issues concerning mountain bikes & parts.

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Fwinns
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2015 2:09 am

by Fwinns

Ok so I'm going 1x10 on my race HT. I currently have a m985 (shadow+) rear mech, with a medium cage, although it's an XT cage because I broke the carbon XTR one in a crash.
Anyway, I was thinking on buying a saint rear mech and swap the two cages (SS on XTR, GS on Saint), and then put the saint rear mech on my trail bike (that will be in 2x10).
I've checked the different tech docs on Shimano website, and it will be compatible, no worries about that.

Has anyone used a saint mech with a medium cage before?
Is a short cage ok for a 1x10 setup? (using a classic 11-36 cassette)

I know it's not really weight weenie (Saint derailleur is about 270g, vs 190g for XTR shadow+), but it weighs the same as a Zee/SLX rear mech, and is far more durable and quiet so I might as well take a saint for the trail bike...

by Weenie


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CGT
Posts: 342
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2007 5:33 pm
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

by CGT

FYI, the XTR Shadow+ is more in the region of 217 grams for the M985/6, and the new M9000 is even heavier at 224ish.

Fwinns
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2015 2:09 am

by Fwinns

Ok so the weight penalty isn't even that big for the saint! I will probably shove a few grams from the xtr going with a SS cage.
190g is probably the weight of the non shadow version of XTR now that I think about it

jooo
Posts: 1510
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 3:48 am

by jooo

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/Shimano-Zee-Rear-Mech-tested-2013.html
Pinkbike wrote:We can't help thinking Shimano have shot themselves in the foot with the Zee rear derailleur. After using the Zee mech for a while we are hard-pressed to offer a reason why you would buy the more expensive Saint.

Why do you want to use Saint? AFAIK the only real differences on Zee are the steel B-knuckle and no 'range change' which is basically for DH bikes. Zee RD's weigh almost exactly the same as Saint.

If all you want to do is use the cage, surely Zee is a better (cheaper) idea?

And if you're doing it for weight savings, a carbon cage would be lighter and not really more expensive.

Fwinns
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2015 2:09 am

by Fwinns

Carbon cages are hard to come by, even the stock xtr ones are more expensive than the complete mech (experience from looking for one when I broke mine). I thought about the zee mech, but it's basically SLX with a short cage, and SLX is way cheaper than zee, while I can get a saint mech from a friend slightly used for about the same price as a new zee. Saint is supposedly much stronger, and has a stronger clutch than zee/SLX, for the same weight.
I'm also switching my trail bike from 3x10 to 2x10, so I'd prefer ditching the non-shadow SGS XTR mech on it to a GS cage mech with clutch. I could buy an XT, but that means buying a short cage for my race bike anyway, which will end up more expensive than the used Saint option.
The only glitch in this plan is that I never heard of anyone putting a medium cage on a Saint, but I don't see where it could be a problem.

Rider10
Posts: 73
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:38 am

by Rider10

If you want a shorter cage for the XTR without the need for a whole new derailleur, you could look into the RADr cage (particularly if you want to go a larger big cog on the rear at some stage).

Fwinns
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2015 2:09 am

by Fwinns

Alright I did the switch.
So in the end, my race bike is on 1x10, with a XTR shadow+ rear derailleur using the SS cage from the Saint (11-36 cassette, 36T up front), and the saint got the GS cage from the XTR derailleur, and is used in a 2x10 configuration.
Sorry for the quality of the pictures, cellphone pics!

XTR with saint cage
Image

Full bike
Image

Saint with GS cage
Image

Full bike
Image

TheRookie
Posts: 926
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 4:23 pm
Location: Midlands, United Kingdom

by TheRookie

Nice looking Sewanee, I am still using an old Niota Al frame for my 10.1Kg FS 'do most of it all' bike.
Impoverished weight weenie wanna-be!
Budget 26" HT build viewtopic.php?f=10&t=110956

Fwinns
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2015 2:09 am

by Fwinns

Thanks :) About the same for me. Don't know how much it weighs (and depends on the wheelset/tire combo I'm using), but it's a perfect trail/training/marathon race bike :)

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hjb1000
Posts: 265
Joined: Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:25 am
Location: Australia

by hjb1000

Nice mod there, good to know it is possible to swap GS for SS

Fwinns
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2015 2:09 am

by Fwinns

Yeah you just need to keep the same type of derailleur, ie clutch vs non-clutch. A Zee SS cage will also fit, and is probably the same as the saint, except for the jockey wheels. For older derailleur without shadow+, you need to find a non clutch cage (m810 Saint for 9spd mechs). I'm not sure a road cage would fit a non clutch mtb derailleur, will have to take a look at the tech docs on Shimano

by Weenie


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User avatar
hjb1000
Posts: 265
Joined: Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:25 am
Location: Australia

by hjb1000

Fwinns wrote:Yeah you just need to keep the same type of derailleur, ie clutch vs non-clutch. A Zee SS cage will also fit, and is probably the same as the saint, except for the jockey wheels. For older derailleur without shadow+, you need to find a non clutch cage (m810 Saint for 9spd mechs). I'm not sure a road cage would fit a non clutch mtb derailleur, will have to take a look at the tech docs on Shimano


Thanks for the info. I've always wanted a Saint RD- they look absolutely bomb-proof.

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